Ever since I can remember when I have been out walking alone, I take into account the presence of single women around me.
I have never “followed” one, consciously I would always cross over a road to pass a lone woman, and I will often lower my eyes, respectfully as I say hello to a stranger when dog walking.
Am I a rarity ?
No I don’t think that I am,
I honestly think that 98% of men are mindful and respectful to women in public but our [ men’s] awareness of women’s discomfort does little to nothing to change the predatory, sexually inappropriate and bullying behaviour some damaged and evil men think is fun or deserving.
All the Vigils and conversations about this subject will not stop these men but efforts to change the justice system relating to the reporting of their behaviours will make a difference in how they are dealt with.
Having said this I found the following observation interesting.
“Novelist Margaret Atwood writes that when she asked a male friend why men feel threatened by women, he answered, "They are afraid women will laugh at them." When she asked a group of women why they feel threatened by men, they said, "We're afraid of being killed."
That's not a fear I've articulated, but I have told my husband that men and women walk in a different world. By instinct (for me, at least) and by teaching, women are watchful for threats all the time while hopefully not letting that watchfulness impede our activities. Before the pandemic, my husband exited a store and aimed straight for the car by the quickest route, cutting between parked cars. I paused just before exiting to scan for whom might be lingering about and walked down the middle of the lanes between cars. Little differences like that add up over time. It's not just on streets or when encountering strangers, either. I remember feeling betrayed when my parents didn't heed my discomfort when my uncle wanted to carry me from the car to my grandmother's door after I'd just had a minor foot surgery. I'd been insisting I could hop the short distance. I was eleven. A couple of years later, he was angrily banned from ever visiting my aunt's house after he'd behaved inappropriately with my same-age cousin.
ReplyDeleteYou articulate beautifully the differences between men and women’s perceptions
DeleteThank you
My sister and I had a similar conversation just last evening regarding the safety of women being alone. She said that most women are always cautious when alone in public. Now my sister is a very fit woman of sixty/fitness instructor/weight trainer and she stills feels vulnerable out there.
ReplyDeleteOpen discussions seem to be the only way men will start to understand how women feel
DeleteI've lived most of my life on countryside, not even on a village but in remote location with no real neighbours. I'm not aftaif of walking alone here, in the middle of forests. I used to live few years in a city when I was in Uni, and I wouldn't walk there alone at night, apart of that part where I lived. There was an actual police academy and they were practice-patrolling there every night. Nowadays I wouldn't walk even there alone without my dog or my official "gear"(uniform) and phone. I'm told by actual criminals I look scary, which might be a bad thing, if someone (man) thinks I'm a threat.
ReplyDeleteBut yes, men are aftaid of embarrasment, women of death.
I never really felt threatened when I lived in Sheffield but I wonder how I would feel going there after dark after living in Trelawnyd for so many years
DeleteI bump into many men on my walks and some do not speak so I say hello.Occasionally I meet someone who I'm wary of and if I can't avoid I still smile and acknowledge them.Most seem pleased to chat.Only today I chatted to a nice man with 2 dogs(he reminded me of you to look at John)-he had the biggest walking pole I've ever seen in my life x
ReplyDeleteA lady shouldn't enquire really and I didn't notice anything untoward-but I did see he was sporting a nice country waxed jacket and a rugged beard x
DeleteSounds lovely
DeleteI get a bit annoyed when people in the media say women shouldn't put themselves at risk by walking alone, especially at night. Erm no, men should learn to control themselves and stop attacking women!
ReplyDeleteExactly .too many times women are being told they have to change their behaviours ...but it’s no good expecting the tiniest percentage of men who offend, to change their behaviours for women k8nd, they just don’t care,
DeletePerhaps the vociferous women at the vigil should consider that it is not only women who get attacked, raped and murdered.
ReplyDeleteNo that’s true , but numbers wise women feature in the majority
DeleteHmmm, no they aren't the only ones but, overwhelmingly they are. Also, if men are worried about it maybe they can start a dar or march. Be nice if women could have a thing without some man or male apologist saying but what about the poor men? Men have lots of events and days that women don't intrude on. Not to mention daily privilege in everything including paay, career, superannuation, and safety in and out of the home.
DeleteHmmm, no they aren't the only ones but, overwhelmingly they are. Also, if men are worried about it maybe they can start a dar or march. Be nice if women could have a thing without some man or male apologist saying but what about the poor men? Men have lots of events and days that women don't intrude on. Not to mention daily privilege in everything including paay, career, superannuation, and safety in and out of the home.
DeleteOne of the few benefits of being old is I've noticed that when I pass a woman walking alone is that they do not seem as afraid, if that's the right word.
ReplyDeleteAging invisibility
DeleteMy husband, a born and bred Londoner, says he will never offer help to a woman, say on the tube, as he doesn't want to scare them. Here though, in our small town, he would. Differing perceptions of risk?
ReplyDeleteSad , very sad
DeleteMy husband is the same. He will even add in children due to the reports of men abusing children. He has actually told a child to stay in the bus shelter when the child said he was lost and walked home to get me. Child was still in the shelter.
DeleteIt's a sad world.
When I read "Travels with Charley" the John Steinbeck book about his travels alone, all over the US with his dog Charley, my first thought was "Wow, I would love to do that!" and immediately, my next thought was "But I wouldn't feel safe." Sigh. It's just the sad truth.
ReplyDeleteYes sad just about covers it
DeleteI once had to drive a long distance by myself after assisting in a family situation in another state. There was no way I would have been able to drive straight through to reach home. I clearly remember stopping at a motel before it got dark,purchasing food to eat alone in my room etc etc. The danger is always there,no matter how old I get. So awful,right?
ReplyDeleteI guess in that situation I would feel threatened too....but at least I have the gender and size to be able to potentially put danger at bay a little more
DeleteI volunteered as a Rape Survivor Advocate for many years, and most of my cases involved predatory males and weaker female targets in vulnerable positions, often not knowing they were in an endangered situation In once case, a young girl working alone in a small shop was lured outside, being told she had a flat tire, kidnapped and raped. The danger is real, information on keeping safe is necessary for all. In fact, I recently related this story to a female working alone.
ReplyDeleteI get this, assertive and combatative victims fair better than weaker more compliant ones
DeleteI once had a call at Samaritans where we had to listen helpless to a woman being beaten at home
As a petite woman, I've always been carefully observant when out by myself in a way my husband and sons never give thought to. I try to casually distance myself from others, but smile and, if close enough, I also speak in a friendly equally casual manner. I know I'm fortunate never to have been in a threatening situation, but I always keep watch. Since I'm getting to be a wee little old lady, it's doubly true... sadly.
ReplyDeleteHugs!
Food for thought babs
DeleteHumans can be terrible to each other and I cannot always figure out why or what to do about it. The haters seem to be louder lately and I do not like it. What should we do?
ReplyDeleteWe will always have predators , such is the sad negativity of being human ....but by dealing with the perpetrators with swiftness and balance and fairness to the victims , things can improve
DeleteYet another reason why I feel fortunate to have been born a man. Not even the fabulous choice in clothing could tempt me to change that
ReplyDeleteWouldn't you just lurve to be able to wear a pair clingy leggings and a crop top tho' Mavis x
DeleteWhat makes you think he doesn't wear exactly that?
DeleteNot with his figure
DeleteYou have obviously not seen the figures that some people somehow and unfeasibly squeeze into clingy leggings and crop tops in "Bonnie Scotland" mate.
DeleteMen have no idea about the threats that all women have been presented with in their lives. Not just the overtly physical ones, but the quiet, hissing suggestive ones, the ones that are truly calculated to let us know that if the man wanted, he could overpower us, do what he wanted. Some men are so good at this, so subtle, that even the idea of reporting the threat is ridiculous. And yet, these can be the most frightening of all.
ReplyDeleteNo. Men really cannot understand. Well, that's not true- slighter gay men certainly can.
Beautifully put......
DeleteI, like Linda P, scan the area before I unlock car door and exit. Plus, I never ever go out once the sun goes down. Even in daylight, I carry pepper spray, a pocket taser and keep a a bigger taser in the car. Overkill? No. The result of real life experiences. I'd have thought my no longer being a young woman would end the danger. Nope. Creeps don't care that I'm 77. They just see female.
ReplyDeleteSobering..........thank you
DeleteI've had a few incidents over the years [pickpocket, weirdo stalker, guy on the train platform w a big knife...] but really do not feel unsafe ever. I am happy if male dogwalkers or birdwatchers say hello. My only fear being alone is of having an fall on the deserted beach, where cell phone coverage is spotty. [NYC, NYC area]
ReplyDeleteThe mobile phone for all its faults has been a god send in nighttime protection
DeleteFor John's non-UK audience, his comments follow the murder of a young woman walking home by a serving police officer and subsequent protests and public unease. As John states 98% of men (and I'd say higher) would never harm a woman. Unfortunately there are individuals - and cultures, who do abuse women, through violence and sexual violence/exploitation. There are also coercive same-sex relationships - and male rape often goes unreported. In a previous sexual health adviser role I once had to listen to a police officer who had traveled to our clinic from another city after being sexually assaulted by another man whilst walking home off-duty. Young males are the group most likely to be assaulted - by other young males. Knife crime and use of firearms are all rising. I absolutely take John's point re Margaret Atwood about women's fear of men and being harmed or killed - men can also be afraid of other men. We can teach respect,we can try to instruct young people about relationships and the unreality and dangers that online pornography propogates, but unfortunately we live in a world where individual perpetrators will always arise. Blaming all men and knee-jerk demands for 6pm male curfews will only breed resentment. We need to stop blaming the police - which appears to be a politicized narrative. We need better and more policing and security for everyone, not less of it, and we also need to be developing a sense of community and awareness of people in our communities. As Leopold Kohr says, these events happen in 'the darkness of a mass society'. We need to look out for each other.
ReplyDeleteThank you for that intelligent comment P
DeleteIt’s funny I , like you think that the percentage of men who abuse is tiny, but I felt that I couldn’t sound flippant by saying 99.9 %
Your comments on same sex attacks is important too...but if women feel silenced these men are doubly so
Probably at least 50% of attacks are never reported, so we don't know the actual stats. They're bad enough as it is, though. -Kate
DeleteI grew up in a village and now live in a small town. I used to work in another town there was quite a drug problem. Fortunately I have never had a bad experience walking alone during the day or night. Yes, I might be vigilant, especially when getting into my car, but I personally think it is wrong to give all men such bad press! Plenty of men are attacked and worse, yes by women too (a close relation works with victims of domestic abuse)
ReplyDeleteThe only place I ever felt proper fear at night was on holiday in sun Francisco
DeleteI cannot Imagine feeling like that every day
Like Lizzy, I've not felt particularly unsafe, or (I should say) didn't. I used to travel alone regularly, including business trips to NYC. When an injury and arthritis began to impact my mobility a few years ago, and I was flying across country alone to see my mom, feelings of vulnerability arrived. It isn't because I'm a woman, a short woman, or gray haired. It's because I can no longer run. Or even walk fast. I couldn't easily fight back. Before? I always figured I could hold my own, or at least put up one helluva fight.
ReplyDeleteAnother underlining of the role of vulnerability here
DeleteEvery woman who has been in an abusive marriage (or relationship) knows this quote. I was one of them, until I was finally able to get myself and my kids free.
ReplyDeleteElle
DeleteI’m sorry....thank you for sharing
Sadly, there always has been and always will be, a small minority of people who are predatory and no amount of legislation will alter that. I think we all (men and women, girls and boys) have to accept that not everyone is friendly, and be alert to danger. A sad fact of life.
ReplyDeletePragmatic and useful.
DeleteTo put an end to predatory and violent men, changes to the law or policing aren't nearly enough. Male culture itself has to change, so that men in general respect women rather than preying on them. And that needs a concerted campaign by male public figures and celebs to permanently alter male behaviour.
ReplyDeleteGood point nick
DeleteWell made
I think if all men had read Ms. Atwood's statement, they would feel more as you do.
ReplyDeleteHow would you answer Ms. Atwood's question?
I think it depends on where you live, partially.
By that, I mean, a rural environment or big city.
I think , I would be more worried about a man who didn't speak to me in passing.
It is the world I live in.
Walking in someone else’s shoes is always hard but when managed can be an amazingly effective learning tool
DeleteAs a young blond student nurse in East London in the 80s I had a few near misses with predatory men. Had to literally think on my feet. One night me and a friend got a mini cab home. She was visiting from my home town in E Midlands. The driver proceeded to drive towards south London and wouldn't listen to my protests about living north of the river. My friend started to cry , at this point I whipped off my white stiletto ( very Essex girl) and said " turn this effing cab round or you'll end up with this heel in your neck" and held it behind his head , he did so and I got him to drop us around corner from my flat. I never reported it. I was terrified but refused to go down without a fight.
ReplyDeleteI am saddened that now at 59 nothing has changed. I realise that now I am older with a few health issues I am prob just as vulnerable but refuse to be cowed by the few assholes. Keep safe all. Xx
Empowering everyone is important here
DeleteEmpowering people to be more assertive and proactive
Sandycat, your tale reminds me of a trip I made in the 80's as a petite 20 year old, travelling up to London for a training course. I had my case and bag in a packed train carriage, and a tall man stood behind me started touching me. I couldn't turn around, so I looked down and positioned my stilleto heel over his toe and then ground down. I only released my pressure when the train came into the next station. I don't think he would have done that again in a hurry. After that, I went on a Reclaim the Night march - sad to say, that 30 years later, not much has changed.
DeleteAustralia is in the midst of similar protests at the moment. And we are tired of it. So very tired, of feeling unsafe, and of the difficult road to justice (which doesn't change the event).
ReplyDeleteI learned today that prosecutions for rape are well down year for year for the last three...
DeleteSobering
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteReading through the comments is so interesting and I am not sure I can add anything. There are things which would help - more police on the streets, better education, but there will always be predattory men. All I know is that I really don't think the protest should have taken place so soon after Sarah's terrible killing. We should let her parents grieve in peace for a time before all women make a protest which might change the law - making longer sentences for offenders, putting more police on the streets.
ReplyDeleteYes the comments have made for an interesting read pat
DeleteI understand so well what you speak of here. There is nothing I love more than to walk in a wooded area but in most places here in the U.S. that is considered to be much too risky unless you have someone with you. My husband is not able to go on long walks due to his health so I simply don't go. I can walk around my neighborhood safely but I would not after dark. There are many problems of violence against those walking alone and in some cases even for men. It is a sad situation that we live in these days.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if we should be also empowering men to share that they may feel intimidated too
DeleteI'm now 72 and I've been sexually assaulted six times, starting when I was five years old. I didn't understand what was happening I just knew it was wrong. One time I worked in a small organisation for the MD who thought it was his divine right to sleep with his female staff! His USP was that I could get pregnant as he'd had a vasectomy. My reply was that I wouldn't get pregnant as I had no intention of sleeping with anyone I was not married to. I was sacked a week later. Slimeball. Ick, he made my skin creep. I won't go into the other details as I have matured and realised that I was not at fault. I was young and beautiful, they should not have been aggresive. Poor Sarah. I hope her family can find some sense of peace. God rest her soul. 💗💗💗
ReplyDelete'I could NOT get pregnant'. Phooee!!!!
ReplyDeleteAnd I'm not counting the guys who have a drink or two and think it's acceptable to run up against you so you can feel their erection. Again, ick!
ReplyDeleteCathy
ReplyDeleteYours above all the above comments shed more light for us men to what it is like living in a “ mans “ world
Thank you for sharing
John, you have moved me to tears. I have never shared this before, even my lovely husband doesn't know. There's no need to upset him. I know he'd defend me to the ends of the earth. Cathy. 😘
ReplyDeleteI thank you again for sharing this with us all here
DeleteIt is safe to do so
Xxx
You portray yourself as a balanced and caring Samaritan
DeleteWhy did your husband leave you
You have never told us
Oh brother ......
DeleteMy husband left me because he didn’t love me anymore
Are you happy now you know the answer?
This blog entry isn’t really about me ..not today
DeleteAttwood's words are telling.
ReplyDeleteSobering Andrew , for sure
DeleteEveryone should feel safe, and sadly many people don't. As a society we need to change this.
ReplyDeleteYes. For all genders all sexuality , all races
DeleteA lot of women have had enough, there is an uprising around the world to support that. Like the song states - I am women hear me roar. Respect seems to be a thing of the past. What happened to the honorable man. My cousin was murdered for daring to tell her husband she wanted to leave him. Women should be revered, they are the Mothers of your children. Show the respect. Some Men could do so much better, lead by example.
ReplyDeleteI hope we all hear your message xx
ReplyDeleteMost women have been a victim of a man once or many times in their lives. To not have fear, is foolish.
ReplyDeleteI refuse to live in fear and come and go when and where I please. I've never personally experienced any threat or attack. That said, I do not go in to dangerous or high risk areas. Generally, I acknowledge others when out and about with, "hello or good day." I've worked with peer men and women on an executive level and had an occasional conflict but find the key is not to get mad or sulk; stay confident and give them back some of the same or simply outsmart them. It is amazing the respect gained.
ReplyDeleteIt is worse than when I was young and footloose. Back then I was only afraid of being hurt. Physically hurt, hit, knocked down. It seems to be end game now. Killed.
ReplyDeleteI think the old cartoon image of the caveman with his club, dragging a woman back to his cave by her hair, should now be discouraged. I don't think many took the image seriously, but there are obviously some who do.
ReplyDeleteTestosterone has a lot to answer
DeleteI am 55 and fat and tall and I have rarely felt unsafe in the street. But it's that old thing where a stranger attacking in the dark is the thing we think of. But it's the hundreds of other situations that will never get reported. Like one night after a drag show, I was leaving a bar in town and a guy came up to me just as I was about to get in my car. He complimented me (I was in full drag) and I smiled and was nice to him as, well, 2000 people were at the gig and for all I knew he was there, his compliment could have been taken that way. But by the time I realised he hadn't been and started trying to get me to come home with him, and had got between me and the car door, I was getting scared. I had been nice, and i couldn't see a way out of it. I told him I was married, faithful, not interested, tired, everything but he wouldn't get it. In the end, empowered by knowing my stiletto booted son was within earshot if I screamed, I got rude and told him to fuck off and leave me alone, which he eventually did. Situations like that leave me feeling shaken, depressed, ashamed and dirty, and he took the joy away from a perfect evening. He sensed my delight and happiness and tried to muscle in.
ReplyDeleteThis kind of behaviour I see a lot of -this pressure to be nice, to have sex, to offer up delight. It disgusts me and it happens to women all the time. And in that moment we are afraid that if we are rude, then they might get nasty. No win.
Another perspective , again wonderfully described
DeleteI am always aware when I walk behind a woman, particularly at night, to stay back and if possible cross the street -- because I know SHE's paying attention and I certainly don't want to cause stress. Atwood's quote is very telling. This story from London is quite shocking, especially as the guy had been suspected previously in a sex crime.
ReplyDeletestilettos are good weapons . sadly bit old to stagger around in them now.
ReplyDeleteRecently Franklin and I were walking and came across some men who were working at improving sidewalks. I thought of how glad I am to be older so men no longer call out to me, and also happy that Franklin is a big dog who appears imposing to people who don't know him.
ReplyDeleteLove,
Janie
There is not a single woman I know that has NOT been assaulted, molested, harassed or frightened by a man or teenage boy. A very sad truth, indeed.
ReplyDeleteMy MiL was attacked while taking a walk in her quiet suburban neighborhood on a sunny weekday late afternoon. A person came up from behind her and beat her so badly around her head, face and chest she was hardly recognizable. A neighbor found her bleeding on the street. My MiL did not know what had happened. It is likely a car came into the area and the attack ended or who knows whether she would have survived. An ambulance was called. Upon hearing the news, I diverted to the hospital on my drive home from work. I stayed with her--as she was terrified of all men at that point and would not release my hand--while she underwent numerous medical tests, including a rape exam. Let me tell you, that is not something anyone should have to go through. She evidently struck back at the attacker at some point as they found skin and blood under her nails, but she had no memory of who attacked her. In fact, every 5-10 minutes she would ask me what happened and why was she in the hospital. This repeated questioning went on for almost a whole week--a week where she would not let me out of her sight. I took off work for a week to be with her 24 hours a day. My FiL was almost as destroyed by the event as she was. The police response? Virtually nothing. Too bad. So sad. Didn't care. Their total indifference was almost as disgusting as the event. She was almost 60 years old when this took place. Never did recover her memory of the trauma, but has never walked alone since that day more than 24 years ago. A permanent fear.
ReplyDeleteShould be opened as a cold case if they still have DNA from under her finger nails.
DeleteI love the story of the lady on the train with her stiletto heel....you are my hero! Some men just think that they are so attractive that women just want them and want to be touched, kissed etc. Many women will just move away and try to not make a fuss, still smiling. That man will still think he is desired. It is time to make a loud and strong "Get Lost" when it happens....forget trying to keep nice. Of course...then we lose our job!
ReplyDelete